Seventy-nine years ago today…
Thanks to photos taken by RCAF photographers, photos which were shared by Guy Fournier, we are going back in time to 11 August 1942 at #9 Bombing and Gunnery School, Mont-Joli, Quebec.
I have created this PDF file to add the information I have found on the airmen who had earned their air gunner wings on August 11th, 1942.
Click above for the PDF file.
There are several links to follow and to learn more about the Fallen.
Mont-Joli
11 August 1942
PL-11090 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, Three airmen who graduated recently from the Royal Canadian Air For Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Que, They are shown in front of a trainer, aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunner’s insignia. From left to right in the picture are: A.H. Carling, 329 Manning Ave., Verdun; G.J.B. Neil, 9 Colquhon St., Stirling, Scotland; Bernard Moody, 12 Nevision Ave., Ferry Bridge Road, Portefrace York, England.
PL-11090
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli Quebec, Course 35A.
Three airmen who graduated recently from the Royal Canadian Air For Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Quebec. They are shown in front of a trainer aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunner’s insignia.
From left to right in the picture are: A.H. Carling, 329 Manning Ave., Verdun; G.J.B. Neil, 9 Colquhon St., Stirling, Scotland; Bernard Moody, 12 Nevision Ave., Ferry Bridge Road, Portefract (sic), York, England
A.H. Carling seemed to have survived.
Gilbert John Bingham Neil did not.
https://losses.internationalbcc.co.uk/loss/220574
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18585245/gilbert-john_bingham-neil
Bernard Moody also did not survive.
Found on a WWII forum
Rank: Sergeant
Trade: Air Gnr.
Service No: 1087282
Date of Death: 05/05/1943
Age: 31
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
405 (R.C.A.F.) Sqdn
Grave Reference 15. F. 16.
Cemetery REICHSWALD FOREST WAR CEMETERY
Additional Information:
Son of Bernard and Annie Rebecca Moody, of Pontefract, Yorkshire; husband of Winifred Louisa Gough Moody, of Pontefract.
No photo
PL-11091
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli Quebec, Course 35A, Two New Zealand airmen training in Canada who graduated recently as air gunners from the RCAF Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Que.
Shown in front of one of their training aircraft just after receiving their air gunners insignia are: L.C. Maunsell, NZ 414318, “Milford”, Masteron, Wairarapa, New Zealand, left, and R.A.F. Woods, NZ 411964, 32 Edgars Road, Westmere, Aukland W.2., New Zealand.
L.C. Maunsell
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/13827293/leslie-cormac-maunsell
https://www.nzwargraves.org.nz/casualties/leslie-cormac-maunsell
https://www.aucklandmuseum.com/war-memorial/online-cenotaph/record/C29142
http://www.rafcommands.com/database/wardead/details.php?qnum=93232
Date: 26 May 43 Aircraft: Lancaster III W4998 Unit 100 Sqdn Airfield /Crash Location , Limburg
Details
Took off 2354 25 May 1943 from Grimsby. Shot down by Flak and crashed 0235 26 May 1943 at the hamlet of Het Voorst (Limburg) near Horst a small town 13 km NW of Venlo Holland where those killed were buried.
R.A.F. Woods
https://www.aucklandmuseum.com/war-memorial/online-cenotaph/record/C21208?n=411964&from=%2Fwar-memorial%2Fonline-cenotaph%2Fsearch&ordinal=0
PL-11092 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, Two airmen who graduated recently from the Royal Canadian Air Force Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Que. They are shown in front of a trainer aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunner’s insignia. From left to right in the picture are: J.C.B.E. Therrien, R120030, Washington, D.C.; J.V.R.J. Veys, R104910, 5712 l6th. Ave, Rosemont, Montreal; G.E. Aubut, R10236, Dorion-Vaudreuil Co., Vaudreuil P.Q.
PL-11092
11 August 1942
#9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Quebec, Course 35A, Two airmen who graduated recently from the Royal Canadian Air Force Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Que. They are shown in front of a trainer aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunner’s insignia.
From left to right in the picture are: J.C.B.E. Therrien, R120030, Washington, D.C.; J.V.R.J. Veys, R104910, 5712 l6th. Ave, Rosemont, Montreal; G.E. Aubut, R10236, Dorion-Vaudreuil Co., Vaudreuil P.Q.
J.C.B.E. Therrien seemed to have survived.
J.V.R.J. Veys
https://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/2046618?Joseph%20Vincent%20Raymond%20Jean%20Veys
PL-11093 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, L.E.J. Cote, R132351, Lampman, Sask., left, and R.E. Goldney, R118056, 141 Windsor Road, North Vancouver, B.C., right, who graduated recently from the RCAF Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Que. They are shown in front of one of the training aircraft just after receiving their air gunner’s insignia.
PL-11093
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli Quebec, Course 35A; L.E.J. Cote, R132351, Lampman, Sask., left, and R.E. Goldney, R118056, 141 Windsor Road, North Vancouver, B.C., right, who graduated recently from the RCAF Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Quebec.
They are shown in front of one of the training aircraft just after receiving their air gunner’s insignia.
R.E. Goldney
https://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/2356406?Robert%20Edward%20Goldney
Contribution by Mark Cote, son of L.E.J. Cote, R132351, Lampman, Saskatchewan
From the Operational Record Books (which are available online), it seems that 405 Squadron was detailed to attack Kiel, a vitally important port on the Baltic Sea coast of the Jutland Peninsula.
They departed RAF Leeming at 2045 on 4 April 1943. It appears that they were briefed to bomb from 16,000 feet and when they arrived, they found that there was significant cloud in the area (below their altitude). The markers for the bombing were not very accurate and the enemy lit decoy fires away from the target to draw the bombers away.
Most of the bombers from 405 Squadron reported dropping their ordnance through the clouds. There were 577 aircraft on this operation. Twelve aircraft failed to return. Reports from the enemy reported few industrial or commercial buildings were destroyed and 26 people died on the ground (meaning that the attacking forces likely lost more people),
Given the circumstances and where the aircraft crashed, it is my speculation that it was downed by antiaircraft artillery — flak. My reason for saying this is that it appears to have happened over the target. If it was lost to an enemy aircraft, those usually occurred away from the target. That there is also no record of anyone claiming the downing of the airplane also suggests it was flak. Because of the overcast, the gunners on the ground would not be able to see what their (usually) radar controlled “predicted” flak was striking — thus no reports. (German gun batteries would report if they actually witnessed any airplane brought down).
Flak was a capricious thing. There was little you could do to avoid it — aside from some weaving and other prescribed tactics. But over the target, the pilot usually had to maintain a steady path — making them more vulnerable. To me, flak would be the unknown and something that you could do little to defend against. It was flak that damaged my father’s aircraft critically and injured him with multiple shrapnel wounds.
To make the aircraft unflyable with flak meant that the damage was severe and it is likely — from the fact that all members of the crew were recovered and buried together — that the end likely came quickly for them. The only possible consolation is that they likely did not suffer for long if at all. They might not have even been aware.
This, as I have said, is informed conjecture. No-one can ever know exactly, but the crew died together. Bomber crews were closer than brothers — they depended on each other like few comrades in arms. I suspect — and I know this from speaking to scores of veterans — that they would want to be aside one another in their final resting places.
I am going to list several of the sites that I have found that cover the members of the crew.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18430884/robert-edward-goldney
http://www.rafcommands.com/database/wardead/details.php?qnum=75472
https://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/2356406?Robert%20Edward%20Goldney
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18430848/william-joseph-foley
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18430781/robert-arthur-damms
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18431465/ralph-james-wright
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18431348/james-alexander_campbell-taylor
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18431276/harry-bertram-sargent
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18431024/william-francis-jordan
Mark Cote
More about Mark’s father…
http://www.thatluckyoldson.ca/
https://youtu.be/gTaALz_3UjI
PL-11094 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, Five airmen who graduated recently from the Royal Canadian Air Force Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Que. They are shown in front of a trainer aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunner’s insignia. From left to right in the picture are: D.L.H. French, 80 QueenI St., Moncton, N.B.; W.E. Burroughs, White Lake Farm, Lafayette, Indiana; W.G. Runnerstrom, 1903 Koloroma Road, Washington, D.C., 5148 Upton Ave., Minneapolis, Minn.; F.F. Yeager, 1938 North 6th Street, Harrisburg, Pa.; G.L. Tyrone, Bogalusa, La.
PL-11094
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli Quebec, Course 35A, Five airmen who graduated recently from the Royal Canadian Air Force Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Quebec.
They are shown in front of a trainer aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunner’s insignia.
From left to right in the picture are:
D.L.H. French, 80 Queen St., Moncton, N.B.; W.E. Burroughs, White Lake Farm, Lafayette, Indiana; W.G. Runnerstrom, 1903 Koloroma Road, Washington, D.C., 5148 Upton Ave., Minneapolis, Minn.; F.F. Yeager, 1938 North 6th Street, Harrisburg, Pa.; G.L. Tyrone, Bogalusa, La
W.E. Burrows?
Found on a WWII forum
I have been researching an 88 Squadron crew who appear to have been operational in the back end of 1943/early 1944 and was wondering if anybody might be able to help.
The pilot was Edward Wickins SIMKINS and he was awarded the DFC in 1944 (LG 19/05/1944). I think the navigator (Alistair Pirnie) was also awarded the DFC in 1945 (LG 26/01/1945) and I was wondering if a citation for the awards survives. I’m guessing they may have been end of tour awards, but cannot be certain. The DFC of Pirnie may actually have been for the end of his second tour.
The regular crew (although I think there were changes over time) were:
E W Simkins (RAFVR)
A Pirnie
D G Salmond
W E Burroughs (possibly RCAF)
An earlier post suggests that a citation might survive, if only for Pirnie:
http://www.rafcommands.com/archive/20459.php
but I am not certain.
Any help would be great.
Johnnie
Reply
Johnnie,
Pirnie’s D.F.C. award was reported in a couple of the Scottish newspapers in January 1945. One article records that he was in the R.A.S.C. in France in 1939 aged 18 as a piper and was at the evacuation of Dunkirk. He joined the R.A.F. and trained in Canada.
The Perthshire Advertiser of January 27th 1945 quotes the citation as follows:
Now on his third tour of operational duty, Flying Officer Pirnie has attacked some of the enemy’s most heavily defended targets. He has participated in sorties against flying-bomb sites and in low-level operations against important industrial targets. Since August, 1944, he has flown in close support of the Allied armies. He has always displayed coolness in [the] face of the enemy, and has achieved some excellent results.
Regards
Simon
Reply
SIMKINS, Edward Wickens, F/O (132170, Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve) – No.88 Squadron – Distinguished Flying Cross – awarded as per London Gazette dated 19 May 1944. Born 1919. Educated at St. Roberts College, Chingford. Enlisted 1940; commissioned 1942. Public Record Office Air 2/9626 has citation drafted when he had flown 35 sorties (76 hours) as a pilot. Also in Air Ministry Bulletin 13985. “Now on his second tour of operational duty, this officer has flown on many sorties of a varied nature. He has proved himself a most competent box leader and on one occasion led the squadron with great success. In November 1943, he was detailed for an attack on Audinghen village and successfully identified and bombed the target in very adverse weather. An outstanding pilot, he has consistently displayed a fine fighting spirit and great devotion to duty.”
Hugh A. Halliday
PL-11095 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, Three United States members of the Royal Canadian Air Force who graduated recently from the Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Quebec. They are shown in front of an RCAF aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunners insignia. From left to right are: C.P. Surles, Box 588, Lake Providence, La.; F.W. Ralph, The Knoll, Fayetteville, N.Y.; J.H. Callahan, 59 West 46th Street, New York City.
PL-11095
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli Quebec, Course 35A.
Three United States members of the Royal Canadian Air Force who graduated recently from the Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Quebec.
They are shown in front of an RCAF aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunners insignia.
From left to right are:
C.P. Surles, Box 588, Lake Providence, La.; F.W. Ralph, The Knoll, Fayetteville, N.Y.; J.H. Callahan, 59 West 46th Street, New York City.
C.P. Surles
http://www.rafcommands.com/database/wardead/details.php?qnum=44014
SURLES, CHARLES PITMAN P/O(AG) J89305. From Lake Charles, Louisiana, U.S.A. Killed in Action Aug 17/44 age 22. #420 Snowy Owl Squadron (Pugnamus Finitum). Halifax aircraft #MZ 687 went down in the Baltic Sea during a night raid against Kiel, Germany. P/Os R.H. Davies, A. Roski, K.G. Boucock, F/Os D.I. Block, F.W. Moffit, G.F. Pritchard, and WO D.B. Lorenz were also killed. Pilot Officer Air Gunner Surles is buried in the Kiel War Cemetery, Schleswig-Holstein, Germany.
https://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/2356860
R.W. Ralph
https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/51846
Narrative:
Shot down by night fighter pilot Oberleutnant August Geiger of the 7./NJG 1, flying a Bf 110 G-4 from Twente airfield.
Target: Dortmund
Call Sign: AR-J
Crew:
Pilot F/Sgt. B.M.T. Davis 405966 RAAF Schoonebeek 3 1 752
Flight engineer Sgt. E. Rowlands 1040539 RAF Schoonebeek 3 1 751
Navigator F/Sgt. K.D. Dyce 412411 RAAF Schoonebeek 3 1 753
Bomb aimer F/Sgt. C. Goldthorpe 405849 RAAF Survived POW
Wo ag F/Sgt. J.S. Biffen 411839 RAAF Schoonebeek 3 1 748
Air gunner F/Sgt. C.S. Wright 421066 RAAF Schoonebeek 3 1 749
Air gunner F/Sgt. F.W. Ralph R/152317 RCAF Schoonebeek 3 1 750
J.H. Callahan seemed to have survived.
PL-11096 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, Three Australian airmen training in Canada who graduated recently from the Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Quebec. They are seen in front of a Royal Canadian Air Force training craft shortly after receiving their air gunners insignia. From left to right are: Aus 413495, L.H. Watters, 284 Park Road, Lidcombe, Sydney, Australia; Aus 412666, W.J. Neilson, 3 Ewenton St., Balmain, Sydney, N.S.W., Australia; Aus.412633, F. McGlinchy, 177 Augustus St., Lockhart, Sydney, N.S.W., Australia.
PL-11096
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli Quebec, Course 35A.
Three Australian airmen training in Canada who graduated recently from the Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Quebec.
They are seen in front of a Royal Canadian Air Force training craft shortly after receiving their air gunners insignia.
From left to right are:
Aus 413495, L.H. Watters, 284 Park Road, Lidcombe, Sydney, Australia;
Aus 412666, W.J. Neilson, 3 Ewenton St., Balmain, Sydney, N.S.W., Australia;
Aus.412633, F. McGlinchy, 177 Augustus St., Lockhart, Sydney, N.S.W., Australia.
L.H. Watters
https://losses.internationalbcc.co.uk/loss/229646/
W.J. Neilson
https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/R1522133
F. McGlinchy
https://losses.internationalbcc.co.uk/loss/115539
https://www.airmen.dk/e777929.htm
PL-11097 11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont Joli Qc., Course 35A, Four airmen from the Maritimes who graduated recently from the Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont Joli, Quebec. They are shown standing by an R.C.A.F. service aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunners insignia. From left to right are: J.H. Walton, Mount Uniacke, Harts Co| N.S.; C.T. Hayward, Montague, P.E.I.; W.L. Bovard, Hampton Village, Kings Co., N.B.; J.L. Stordy, Brookvale, Lot 30, P.E.I.
PL-11097
11 August 1942 #9 Bombing & Gunnery Wing Parade Mont-Joli, Quebec, Course 35A.
Four airmen from the Maritimes who graduated recently from the Bombing and Gunnery School at Mont-Joli, Quebec.
They are shown standing by an R.C.A.F. service aircraft shortly after receiving their air gunners insignia.
From left to right are:
J.H. Walton, Mount Uniacke, Harts Co| N.S.; C.T. Hayward, Montague, P.E.I.;
W.L. Bovard, Hampton Village, Kings Co., N.B.; J.L. Stordy, Brookvale, Lot 30, P.E.I.
Walton
https://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/2964967?Jonathan%20Harvey%20Walton
Stordy
https://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/remembrance/memorials/canadian-virtual-war-memorial/detail/2046202?John%20Lawrence%20Stordy